The VP Debate: Palinpalooza (Wink, Wink)

Jon Cummings: My junior year at college I took a creative writing class in which all the students received copies of each other’s short stories and offered critiques in a roundtable format. Almost all the students were earnest, ambitious types practicing to write the Great American Novel, and most of the mistakes we made were problems of overreach – of attempting to go from zero to William Faulkner in 8 seconds. One young man, however, submitted a sweet little story that seemed to be written for – and by – an eighth grader. Its plot was simplistic, its characters were cute but vapid, its message was utterly immature – yet the whole thing was rendered successfully, as far as it went. My classmates and I sat around the table and had no idea what to say to this guy; we didn’t know for sure whether he’d really tried to write a children’s story, or whether this effort represented the full firing of his intellectual circuitry. So we gingerly danced around our critiques, piling on the patronizing praise for what he was “able to accomplish” with the “type of story he wrote.” And then, after we’d made the author feel like a winner, we dug into the next story with the kind of analytical intensity each of us would want applied to our own work.

That story pretty much sums up my feelings about tonight’s festivities. It’s a 200-word substitute for “Joe Biden was playing chess, and Sarah Palin was playing Candyland.” She announced at the outset that she wouldn’t really be participating in a debate – “I may not answer the questions the way you want me to, or the way the moderator does …” – and she proceeded to instead offer up a manic, 90-minute imitation of Dolly Parton hosting Hee-Haw, replete with winks and nose-scrunches and “darns” and “you betchas” and rambling soliloquies so full of shit the highlights in her hair faded to brown.

Neither Gwen Ifill nor Biden chose at any point to remind Palin that there were actual questions she was supposed to be answering, actual policies she was meant to be discussing. Palin’s answers were brain dumps interspersed with folksy witticisms aimed directly at the type of folks who are predisposed to want a know-nothing hockey mom rather than a dedicated public servant living in the Naval Observatory. Ifill and Biden didn’t seem to know what to make of this adorable bumpkin, so they carried on as though they were still taking part in something serious and Palin was merely the comic relief.

Perhaps Biden knew that his workmanlike effort, rooted in the traditional VP-nominee meme of attacking the top of the opposing ticket, was doomed to pale in comparison to Palin. So he mostly stuck to appearing thoughtful and (vice) presidential, though he occasionally attempted to approximate her Petticoat Junction shtick with references to his own, more urban working-class background.

There’s no doubt Palin’s millions of supporters were eating out of her hand, finding in her the down-home wisdom and heartland values they imagine themselves to have. Meanwhile, millions more of us sat slackjawed on our sofas, astounded that this cartoon character might rise to the nation’s second-highest office after announcing flat-out that she wouldn’t take the debate seriously, wouldn’t submit to any more questioning from the news-media “filter,” wouldn’t – in short – even attempt to clear the lowest qualifying bar for a national politician.

Make no mistake, Palin gave a bravura performance tonight; it’s amazing what she was “able to accomplish” with the “kind of material she had.” But now that we’ve congratulated her for crossing the finish line without falling on her face, can we please go back to focusing on the serious business of (and serious participants in) this campaign? Because Sarah, your 15 minutes are up.

Ted Asredagoo: Remember the hype and excitement surrounding Star Wars, Episode 1? And remember how disappointed you were by the prevalence of Jar Jar Binks, your butt getting sore in the seat, the bad acting, and the like? Well, this debate — while in many ways more substantive than the Obama/McCain debate — used the “Hype 101” model of making something out of very little. We were led to believe that Sarah Palin would implode on screen when trying to answer difficult questions (Damn you, Katie Couric!). We were hoping Joe Biden would fall into the sexism trap where a finger point, a sneer, or remark could be replayed over and over in attack ads and 24-hour cable news. But it never happened. Instead, here’s what we got:

“The ultimate bridge to nowhere.”

“Your plan is a white flag of surrender in Iraq.”

Those were the knockout punches that both campaigns need to feed the noise machine — and we’ll probably see a replay of those lines for the next few weeks. However, for the rest of us who were interested in what both candidates had to say about issues that affect our lives, I’m not sure we got clear answers from either. Palin suffered from an acute case of vomiting stock answers, bumper-sticker slogans, and Reagan-inspired quips about government, taxes, and freedom. Biden suffered from an annoying rash of confusing policy answers, an inability to look at Palin or the camera, and a lack of any sense of compassion while talking about middle-class America’s problems.

I’m not sure anyone but die-hard McCain supporters bought Palin’s line that when McCain said the fundamentals of our economy were strong (as the economy was spiraling downward), he was talking about the strength and resilience of the American worker. Nor was Biden to be believed when he said that he was against gay marriage after he listed all the civil rights he supported for gays. I completely understood what Biden was saying, but he couldn’t articulate it well. What he meant was that when it comes to religious organizations, they have the freedom to marry or not marry whomever they wish. However, when it comes to political equality, the government cannot discriminate on civil rights issues. Palin, on the other hand, tried to paint herself as a tolerant person. But what emerged after all the qualifying remarks is that she does not tolerate gay marriage, and will fight to oppose it (score one for the base).

The one point where Biden should have turned it back on Palin was when she made the “white flag of surrender” remark. Biden was clear on what he meant by a timetable for withdrawal: Shift responsibility for domestic security to the Iraqis over a 16-month period; as that happens, draw down U.S. troops; and have the Iraqis shoulder the cost of the transition by working with the Iraqi government.

Yet, what did Palin say after launching her “surrender monkey” zinger? She went on to list what McCain would accept as a victory in Iraq: A stable civilian government; a domestic security force that can keep the peace; U.S. ground commanders, working with the Iraqi government, reporting to McCain that the government is stable and the Iraqi forces are keeping the peace.

As she finished explaining the McCain plan for victory in Iraq, my 12-year-old daughter turned to me and said, “Didn’t she just repeat what Biden said about getting out of Iraq?” Except for the 16-month timeline, both plans are almost identical. Unfortunately, Biden didn’t pick up on that and throw it back at her. Ah well, there’s always plenty of opportunity to do so on the stump.

However, Biden really seemed to get his mojo going when he ripped into McCain’s maverick image: Specifically, how McCain has been no maverick when it comes the lives of middle-class people (i.e., decreasing debt, improving health care or education, ending the war, or, heck, even helping reduce the cost of heating oil).

Palin was on solid ground when she talked about Alaskan oil issues, her family, herself, herself, and herself. She’s clearly comfortable with her identity as a hockey mom, wants to reassure everyone out there that she’s “just like them,” and – “You bet’cha” – is gonna do her best as vice president. Now, whether the image Palin projects is believed by those who aren’t already 150% in the tank for her remains to be seen. My initial reaction is that she didn’t succeed. Nor did Biden convince the small number of undecided voters that an Obama-Biden administration will fundamentally make their lives better — mostly because he couldn’t effectively articulate how.

One thing is certain: As we head into the weekend, and get results on the House vote on the bailout, sentiments like “they hate us for our freedoms,” “a city on a hill,” and “government is the problem” are going to be eclipsed by the big story on everyone’s mind: the economy.

Dw. Dunphy: Subtitle for the evening: “The Truthiness Hurts,” and boy, did it ever. If sight could inflict pain, my clock would be bleeding on the nightstand because I couldn’t wait for this one to be over. In one corner, Joe Biden, average Joe, shopper of Home Depot, eater at local diners. In the other, Sarah Palin a/k/a Tracy Flick, speaking in breathless spirals of talking points but never really saying anything, winking, smirking, reminding all of her hometown status and, occasionally, wielding a competitor’s compliment like a loaded gun.

The pattern set by the first presidential debate remains consistent. Biden clung to dissected policy ideas, sometimes to distraction, often to abject boredom, and more often showing correction as defensiveness. Palin followed McCain’s lead and kept shoving “jes’folks” personality up front, kept kneeling at the altar of the Gipper, and often displayed more snark than I care to stand from an elected official. (Editor’s note: Watch that snark-bashing, buddy. You’re pissing on your bread and butter…) Biden got a couple shots off, too; his inclusion of a “bridge to nowhere” stinger stands out as a notable point, as was his calling out Palin’s constant flagellation of McCain’s maverick appropriation. But where the zingers were tangential to him, they were clearly mainline for her.

What Palin got across was the ability to stand up to the microphone and project. Not that everyone thought she would completely fall apart under the stress and scrutiny, but the lingering belief that she could have was just as damning. If anything, the debate proved she could at least hold the podium and not collapse, the way so many of her recent interviews seemed to indicate that she might. She failed to project an honest sense that she could go off-script yet maintain the through-line of the topic. Mostly, she used Wasilla and Alaska and her husband and kids as deflection, not illustration. These digressions bother me most because we have come to see George W. Bush as a master of the personality sleight-of-hand.

And here’s where I take on a dreaded cliche, the whole heartbeat-away thing. Honestly, I’m not comfortable with either of these vice presidents becoming president in the heat of crisis. While I think Biden is clearly the lesser of the two evils, his conflicted senses of hubris and self-effacement seem terribly at odds with each other, like he could very well be a serious flip-flopper. Palin comes across as someone who has been heavily coached; should she ever assume the presidency, she seems like she would be only too happy to have a Cheney of her own. In my opinion, that ought never happen in American politics again. She keeps telling us she has executive experience, but then again, she’s been telling us a lot in her Fibonacci spirals of logic, always ending in the war-and-oil groove.

Mostly – and this sounds horrible but it is true, and I think most of you readers might agree – I was hoping this debate would be funnier. That these two held forth without imploding into Dadaesque parapses of insane improvisation is rather disappointing. Good for America that they’re able to present the illusion of readiness and competence, but I could have watched Forgetting Sarah Marshall in that span of time and felt a lot more satisfied.

Oh well, on to Tuesday and the next round with the presidential candidates. Get your B.S. detectors all charged up, and we’ll see you then.

Tags: , , , , ,

  • Jamielyon
    I thought one of the more interesting Non-answers that Gov. Palin gave was in regard to her actual Achilles heel versus her perceived Achilles heel. By not answering the question and instead listing her qualifications, it left some question in my mind as to whether she has that Bush-like inablity to see any self-dficiencies, or if she just didn't know what an Achilles heel is.
  • Alicia
    The trouble is, it doesn't really matter if she answered the questions or not. What matters is she had enough moments where she looked and sounded good so that if you're a person who didn't watch the debate, but are tuning in today to catch the highlights, it looks like she gave a strong performance and that she won. I think that was their strategy, hence all the mugging and winking for the camera.
  • I thought the same thing as I watched it. When she hadn't gone off the rails after half an hour or so, I knew the narrative was going to be "she didn't totally fuck up -- wow!"

    On the bright side, the post-debate polls broke totally Biden's way. Just because she cleared the bar doesn't mean she won.
  • Nice coverage, guys. Let me just add something:
    Biden won the debate hands down. Why? Because they both had jobs they had to NOT do. He had to not come across as a bully, smarmy or sexist and a know-it-all. She had to not turn into one of Mudd's androids when presented with flawed logic by Mr. Spock.
    And they needed to take the game to their opponent.
    Done and done. I could go on and on about how badly Palin did (really? McClellan?!? Really????) but let's focus on the two real moments of the debate. The "you're no John Kennedy" moments. The ones that are always best served when they are organic and not rehearsed or just semi-rehearesed. There were two. And at least one of them will live on for a long time, if not ever.
    The first was when Biden took the air out of the Maverick talk. At first I thought it was too late and now I realize that it was perfectly timed. After she used that buzzword 9 times he took it away from them. Probably forever for a lot of people. And she of course, had no retort since she would prefer to speak to americans without the filter of the media, which means, of course, scripted.
    The other was the most real moment of the entire campaign. When Biden, speaking about being a single father after the tragedy of losing his wife and child in an accident, even 30 years hence, seemed honest and real and brought a tear to this father's eye. And it made the hoisting of retardo-prop at the end of the show seem callous, calculated and just plain sad pandering. (By the way. Why the fuck isn't that kid in bed???)
    So here's the way I basically described what is going to happen on my succinctly semi-genius blog, Septenary.

    "If I was a money man in the evangelical wing of the republican party I would be asking her to a) pull away from John McCain a bit and b) run for Ted Stevens senate seat. I imagine that there are a lot of gay-bashing, ethnic-hating, simple minded, gun-caressing republicans that see her as their bright and shining future.*
    Okay. I don't think a) she will make it for 8 years in the senate let alone win that seat and b) the evangelical, hate spewing segment of the right will even exist in 8 years.
    Because make no bones about it:

    The next president will be president for 8 years."

    Trust me. McCain is going to start showing up (or his money, at least) in Oregon and Minnesota and North Carolina as a bid to hold those precious senate seats. The RNC has given up the ghost and McCain knows he's the loser. But he'll game it for 30 days beacuse it's politics and ya never know.

    But he knows.
  • David_E
    Any smart thing you wrote was wiped away by "retardo prop."

    Grow up.
  • I would love to retract it but, truth is, that is how they are treating that kid. They aren't being responsible parents, they are lifting him up, in front of cameras, with hot flashing lights everywhere and sending a callous, contrived and, I believe, hateful message to their constituency. It's repugnant. As the father of a child who died of a terminal illness I find this despicable.
  • David_E
    I wish you had said it that way prior, rather than slander the child (and hundreds of thousands like him) who can't defend themselves.

    It's not P.C. It's simple empathy.
  • Something tells me you didn't laugh when you read this: http://www.theonion.com/content/most_recent/Poi...
  • Thanks, Jeff. I actually missed that. Hysterical.
    When my ex's family decided to make a short film starring my daughter to inaugurate some fly-by-night film fleece operation, they did so by starring her as the poor, decrepit, cystic fibrosis kid who was probably gonna die any day.
    At that moment they ceased having a "terminally ill child dealing with cystic fibrosis" to "hey, look at Weezy, the tear-wrenching sympathy machine."
    What gets me is that Palin can use her kid in such a callous fashion but if I label it EXACTLY as she is doing it (the retarded prop) I am a bad person.
    It's total PC.
    I empathize with the child. In fact, I feel terrible for it. But, this was a sick kid used as a photo op. I didn't see Bristol there? Why not? These are hateful people who put nice words on evil deeds. Well, someone has to put them in their place.
  • David_E
    Y'know, I do get irony. (And I did laugh at that Onion story.) I just did not take your point as humor. I guess I see a lot of daylight between "prop" and "retardo." To me, the latter is personal, and really unnecessary in this context.

    But that's me. I'm kinda sensitive.
  • mojo
    I am uncomfortable with it too. Can't stand Palin, but WTF is she supposed to do? Deny his existence? Be more like a man and stuff the fam in the closet except at the debates and convention? As BIden put it last night, challenge the judgment and not the motivation. And I don't think there's any bad judgment on display here (except...am I the only one who thinks her daughter who always carries him around is a little small for the job? I hold my breath wondering if she's gonna topple right over carrying that kid...stairs have to be brutal! It'd be about like me carrying a Honda Civic around).
  • DE
    "WTF is she supposed to do? Deny his existence?"

    Well, that's essentially what she's doing with her preggers oldest daughter. Did you see her up on stage after that debate? No. And that's because it would remind everyone that she has a 17-year-old pregnant daughter. I agree with Allen that they're using Trig as a prop.
  • David_E
    I think we all agree on that point.
  • mojo
    I think I don't agree. I think that Trig just....is. If he's not there, we'll rip on her denying his existence. If he is, he's a prop. I think Trig should be left out of the discussion. Just like gayness and blackness and whiteness should be. They just...are. There is no good bad or up or down. As for what is her name, Bristol? That's an interesting discussion, no. My question on Bristol is, why did McCain pick Palin as VP knowing about Bristol in the first place? Cunning or reckless?
  • mojo
    and by there is no good bad up or down...I mean, no one should care if I am black or white or gay or straight any more than they give a crap that I use Michelins or Firestones on my minivan. Or that I have a minivan.
  • Trouble is, they flaunt the kid. He was delivered to her at the end if the speech. Todd can't hold his kid? And why not leave it at home? Surely they could get a sitter, after all, Bristol wasn't busy. Trig is a prop. A heinous use of that child, I might add
  • mojo
    well, I've shoveled some coal into this hopper and I shall depart. I do hope if Palin's elected (clearly I do not prefer that outcome) she becomes an advocate for handicapped children. I would be pleased to pay more taxes toward that, and her pollsters would have a hard time disputing that it's a bad play.
  • JonCummings
    My wife's comment every time she sees the Palin family trotted out is, "Why doesn't Todd ever hold that baby? The world could be ending, and nobody would let Todd near that baby!"

    It's actually an a propos question, because as an at-home dad myself I couldn't help but notice that babies tend to become most comfortable around the person who's caring for the child most frequently.

    Those who claimed it was sexist to question Sarah's decision to run for VP with a special-needs newborn noted that Todd is perfectly capable of caring for Trig. From the looks of things, though, he never wants to hold him. Which begs the question, WHO IS PARENTING THIS BABY?!?!?!

    Inquiring minds want to know.
  • You People are Sick
    maybe it isn't any of your business who is caring for tis baby but the Palin's? But my best guess is Todd or one of the kids was holding Trig DURING THE DEBATE? I don't know about you, but if I just debated in front of 70 million people, I'd want to hold my baby first thin! and not be an asshole to suggest otherwise.
  • steve
    You are a deplorable person. Typical hypocrite liberal, cry for political correctness in language - but not for you.
  • mojo
    Ease back on that calling Jon deplorable stuff, bud. Or were you singling out someone else as deplorable?

    Unless you can, uh, point us to the "cry for political correctness" anywhere here on this page? And then...can you cite said actual deplorable act?

    Otherwise this looks like another heapin' helpin' of ditto'ing.
  • steve
    using the term "retardo-prop" is deplorable beyond words. That's what I'm referring to, as others did.
  • mojo
    All right, you're talking about Allen, but you commented under jon, so we cleared that up that confusion. Now, who among us is crying for political correctness, again?
  • steve
    no one is mr. mojo, no one. My comment was meant in general ok.

    The main point is that calling her kid a retardo-prop shows utter hate & contempt. As another post said, he needs to grow up.
  • I think your main point is that all liberals are hypocrites, actually, which shows just as much contempt. Were you this upset when the incumbent mocked a death row inmate, or when a presidential candidate started singing about war?
  • steve
    It says a lot that you all seem to be fine with calling her kid a retardo-prop. Enjoy sleeping with yourselves
  • I hope that wide brush you're painting with saves you from breaking your neck after you fall off your high horse, Steve-O.
  • steve
    I challenge you to rise above hate and at least say that he shouldn't have used that term. If not, I'll assume your pretty cool with calling her kid a retardo-prop

    The ball is in your court. Do you have some civility on your high horse?
  • Oh, I'm sure you'll assume whatever you like no matter what I say -- based on the comments you've already made here, assuming things about people is one of your favorite things to do.

    For the record, although Allen used a phrase I wouldn't have chosen, I know him, and I know he's an extremely compassionate person, especially with regards to children, so I'm willing to give him a mulligan for it. I also understand why you might take issue with what he said -- but what gets my dander up is when you come in here and start throwing insults at all liberals everywhere, or the site in general. I think you're guilty of demonstrating some of the same behavior you're condemning so loudly.

    Not that I expect you to stop now. You'd be much less entertaining if you did, actually, so I'd be sort of disappointed. Keep right on issuing blanket condemnations and wallowing in your righteous indignation.
  • steve
    you know what, if you say he's a good guy I'll take your word for it. I just wish people would tone down the hate and go after Palin or any of them based on their politics - not their handicapped children.

    And I insult both liberals and conservatives, as I feel that both groups (aka D's and R's) robotically follow a dogma vice actually think about issues and form their own opinions. If they actually took time to form their own opinions about things, both parties would collapse and the country could put aside the failure of the 2-party system, and all the hate, & partisanship that comes along with it, as demonstrated by Mr. Allen's original comment.

    Hell, I'm sure folks in Congress throw insults at each other that are just as bad (maybe not in the open but no doubt at the water cooler). That's what the two party system has gotten us. Children throwing insults at each other.
  • But he WAS going after Palin -- for using her baby as a prop. You disagreed with the way he phrased it, that's one thing, but his original point remains.
  • mojo
    Amen.
  • Steve, how is was said may have not been the most elegant, but she's using the status of her child the same way W uses his cowboy hat. Now THAT'S deplorable.
  • steve
    "may not have been the most elegant" Really? C'mon. You know as well as I do that it was deplorable. And if it were reversed and Biden had a special needs kid and someone made the same comment everyone on this blog would be screaming bloody murder.

    Hate her politics, don't be mean and say hateful things about things she can't control.

    Christ is there any civility left......
  • I'm actually offended by how Biden keeps using his dead wife and the accident that nearly killed his kids... Yes, it happened, but I'm of the mind that the kids are off the table. They shouldn't be used for jockey positioning.

    It's simply that Palin is so much more vocal about her special-needs baby, and by plopping the kid front and center, of course there's going to be this sort of attention paid. Truly protecting the kid would be to keep the kid out of the spotlight. Aside from the son going to Iraq, you don't see her being as vocal about her daughters, do you? Isn't she, by her actions, causing this baby to be singled out.

    You have to admit that much.
  • steve
    Ok, agreed. But I have no problem with it being said the way you just did. Throwing epithets out there does nothing but show anger, hate, and childishness. That was the reason I commented.
  • David_E
    This was my original point, as well. I happen to agree with Allen re: Trig's political "appearances." I was just so taken aback with the invective he made his point with that the bitterness and thoughtlessness of the words overwhelmed the message.

    Again, I don't consider this PC so much as simple empathy and humanity. Surely the same words hurled back at Allen would hurt in a similar situation.
  • If I was using my daughter as a means to propagate my own standing then someone calling me out and referring to her as "weezey McSympathy child" would probably be right.
    She's dead now but she would have most likely laughed her ass of at that statement.
  • mojo
    I wanted Biden to say at some point "McCain says Obama's not ready to lead because he's inexperienced in Washingotn. What's your excuse?"

    I also wanted him to call them out on "You keep saying 'We have won or are close to in Iraq' and yet McCain keeps saying 'our gains are so fragile in Iraq, we must keep going!'" Which is it? Massive victory or not? Please clarify.

    I also wanted him to say "you say you're 'close to the heartland' and claim to be practically standing out there amongst the amber waves of grain, but yet 7 times I've also heard you say you're 'up there in Alaska.' as if that's a bigger, better place to govern than, say, Illinois." Please pick one or the other, you can't have it both ways.

    I guess discretion is the better part of valor and Biden (despite his mojo-esque tendencies to speak first and think later) showed rare discipline last night. At points I think she was baiting him to rip into her with a couple insults and clearly exaggerated accusations but he brung his A game to the debate.

    As far as Palin's performance goes I agree with everyone here who basically says it was a stump speech and not a debate. Hide your lack of debate skills and lack of knowledge on the issues behind "Maverick bucking the controlling media" bluster. The scary thing is that the conservative media eats it up. I guess they're suckers...and I get the picture that more people will catch the sound bites than actually watched the debates so her debate technique or actually answering questions won't matter.

    Face it, Los Angeles vs. Chicago simultaneously playing a baseball game (first and third TV markets) did not help the viewership so the soundbite-ology that both candidates practiced was probably sounder strategy than actual debating.

    Palin, to her credit, was smooth as advertised in many of the previews. She was every bit as telegenic as left and right wing media predicted she would be. She gracefully dodged answering questions, much more gracefully than any candidate I've seen since William Jefferson Himself.

    By the way, the "Candyland and chess" line is the best, most concise description of the debate I have seen. I watched it and have read both left, right, and neutral stories about it...and our own Jon Cummings nails it.

    My summation: Not as good as the Stockdale VP debate, but let's be realistic--will any debate, ever, top that nutso-fest?
  • I'm totally late to this conversation, but I have to say that this whole article articulately reflects the conversation my wife and I have been having since the debate...

    and I completely second "Candyland and chess" as the best, most concise description of the debate.
  • DE
    Oh, and no one mentioned her response to the powers of the Vice President bit and whether she agreed with Cheney on his interpretation of the Constitution. I truly think she did not expect the question, did not know how to answer it, so her instincts told her to agree with the position of the sitting Republican VP. Either that, or she's just as crazy and dangerous as Cheney! But I can't give her that much credit.
  • mojo
    I loved that whole exchange. It was almost as if I was watching afootball game. I yelled to my wife Kate, c'mon Joe!!! Quote the constitution!!!! ANd when he did, I did something similar to an end zone dance. Fantastic, at least on the scale of Watered DOwn Debate Theater us thinkin' people's forced to endure.
  • I get very, very sad the day after these things. The reason why is because I have totally gone in the tank with the thought that Biden won, that he proved to be more knowledgeable than Palin and presented himself with a more professional, serious demeanor. The pundits seemed to agree on that and I thought, hey, good news.

    Then, the day after, television and radio trot out the "man on the street" commentaries and the public fall over themselves to praise Palin. "She thinks like we think" and "She speaks for us" and "She's the voice of the common person." Then I start wondering, if I sharpen up my coffee spork the right way, this could all be over with right now.
  • Oldetymer
    Damn DW, is that what you want in your obit, death due to a spork? at least bring out the silverware before you make a rash decision.
  • :-D Shea
    So how did Gwen do? Is she going to sell a lot of books?
  • Gwen did neither good nor bad. She was adequate, but in fairness, she did keep Palin's response times lower than Biden's. Some say that was a bias toward the Obama / Biden ticket but I disagree. If you really want to help the ticket, you keep the opponent rambling until they shatter. Ifill's interpreted "help" if it was intended completely backfired.
  • Dan
    Let's face it. This debate means zippo. Obama's going to win this thing, despite the fact that he's an empty suit. The guy came out of nowhere, has little or no track record, and thus a lot of people fill this vessel with their own projected hopes and dreams. He's an articulate, smooth talking lawyer. And that's about it. I'm not thrilled about McCain either, but Obama's meteoric rise is a real headscratcher.
  • But how is it a head-scratcher? The Republican Party is stereotypically viewed as being old, fat, white men. In a time where people want to run from what they might view as abject failure, they move toward just about everything atypical of the GOP.
  • Has anybody perused the fact check on this debate from Newsweek? It seems the verbal fudge was flying fast and furious from both sides. So I guess in the end it boils down to style?

    Frankly, I haven't watched the debate. I plan to do so tonight. Did Biden ask Gwen Ifill to rise up from her wheelchair for applause?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2mzbuRgnI4
  • To directly address this, that's why we have Schultz smack dab between Biden and Palin, if his famous catchphrase is any indicator.
  • For the record (and thanks to those that came to my defense) here's what I meant regarding the "retardo-prop" comment.
    This is not how I refer to Trig. Nor is it how I imagine anyone else does, least of all that family.
    However, the way they are treating Trig and his place in the campaign is as a prop. A "disabled" child. A "special" child. In the 70s we called it retarded and, yes, it was a pejorative even then. Using that word in that way was my way of giving voice to just how low they have gone in their pandering to what they consider their base.
    I couldn't put the word in quotes because no one has actually used it, but I can actually imagine a time or a place where Steve Schmidt and Rick Davis are in a smokefilled back room and Steve says, "Yeah, at that point she should pick up that retarded kid of hers and kiss it." Because that's how these people think.
    I know. I've dealt with their ilk in advertising brainstorm sessions, i social circles, etc.
    Sadly, the point got lost because of the un-pc word I used.
    To this point I add this:
    I am working at an Obama HQ in a very decidedly african american neighborhood. Today someone brought two bags of Oreos. One regular and the other white or vanilla.
    I turned to one of my co-horts, a salty and very well respected mover and shaker in the hood and asked, "Can we put up a sign over the white ones that says 'White Only'?"
    His suggestion was that we make sure we put one over the regular that say "Blacks Only".
    The office manager shouted out, "No! I like the white ones!"
    In a PC white majority office, I would have been strung up for this.
    I think I prefer this office.

    In short: sorry, didn't mean to offend. But I still think Trig is being used. And it's sad.
  • And, like I said before, you don't see Palin trotting out her young unwed teen daughter like that. Politicians, like Hollywood stars, who use their kids as any sort of publicity point make me recoil.
  • JonCummings
    I think that's too general a statement. Practically EVERY politician trots out the family at some point -- if he or she has one -- because a pretty picture of the wife/husband and kids says, "Look, I've got peeps -- I'm just like you."

    If it's done judiciously, it works and it's inoffensive. One of the few things the Clintons did well in merging their personal and political lives was to show off just enough of Chelsea -- the walk to Madison Square Garden at the '92 convention was memorable -- without exposing her too much, and they were vigilant to keep her out of the media. (Georgie Boy wishes he'd been a bit more vigilant with Barbara and Jenna during his first term.)

    Obama went too far when he allowed "Extra" to do a family interview over the summer, but he reined it in quickly. Otherwise, his trotting out of the fam has been nothing but a positive for him, especially in an election where he's been trying to beat back the "this guy's not like you" attacks from Hillary and the Republicans.

    To that end, expect Michelle and the girls to take a higher profile over the next four weeks as McCain and the Rovians pull out all the despicable Republican stops. Batten down the hatches...
  • "To that end, expect Michelle and the girls to take a higher profile over the next four weeks as McCain and the Rovians pull out all the despicable Republican stops. "

    Yes, that would be while Obama runs truthful informative commercials about how McCain wanted to cut Social Security checks by 50%. ;-)

    I still say the best way to decide this is pistols at thirty paces.

    The Bitter Cling-er
  • JonCummings
    Cannot defend that ad...though, far as I can tell, it aired only once before they pulled it in shame...

    And hey, at least Social Security (and "private accounts" in a stock market that's down 2000 points lately) is an issue that's relevant to voters, unlike the crap the Republicans are cooking up to change the subject...
  • You know, I expect "some" sort of traipsing out of family. Kids, etc. It's part and parcel of the sport of politics and everyone knows that. To an extent.
    When Palin not only made mention of her "Special Needs" baby but then showed said baby being coddled by...yet another baby, they introduced not just the children quotient but a callous, kids-as-happy-meal-toy aspect. To that end, bringing the kid on stage at the end of the veep debate was nothing more than a photo op with the re****o-prop.
    And yet, Biden's quick choking up did more for me with images of dead children that I have never seen.
    The difference is that the former is crass and calculated and the latter seemed to be somewhat real.
    For some reason people really want to give her a pass on things like that and I don't think we should. I think she is exactly what she seems: an opportunistic, social/political climbing television weather-twinkie (let's see who is offended by that one) who used her looks to get anywhere she could. In many ways, Sarah Palin sets the women's movement back 50 years.
    She should be stopped.
    Thankfully, it's happening as we speak.
  • JonCummings
    Hey, she's a sports-twinkie, not a weather-twinkie. There's a crucial difference. (Fewer green screens, I believe.)
  • Great. So even less work.
blog comments powered by Disqus